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December 2, 2022

Can We Say Told You So?

By Kirk Allen & John Kraft

On September 18, 2021

IL. (ECWd) –

I must first give a shout out to Griffin High School in Springfield, Illinois, now Sacred Heart-Griffin. If there is one thing I remember so vividly during my high school days, it was my history and civics classes.  It included not only the key foundational points of our Constitution, but actual applications of the teaching through things such as a mock trial in a real courtroom and reporting based on facts, not opinions.

That experience taught me an important lesson, which is you must know your rights, how they are protected, and why it is so important to speak up when things are wrong.

March 15th, 2020 we knew what our Illinois Governor was pushing was wrong.  We threw the red flag so that others could learn the truth and provided the actual laws that should have been followed.  We urge everyone to read that article at this link. We nailed it!

Fast forward to the current time and we see judges applying the Illinois Administrative Code as it relates to mask mandates by schools.  Many schools failed to stand up for the rule of law.  Instead, most acquiesced to the tyrannical intimidation doled out by the Governor and the Illinois State Board of Education and ignored the fact those two state entities had no authority nor enforcement power to do what they were doing.    How ironic that in April of 2020, we told the world that the Administrative Code, as it relates to the then-Pandemic, is the rule of the land in this article.  We nailed it!

While at the time of the above article the key subject matter was business closures, the application of the Administrative Code is no different when it comes to schools, kids, and quarantines.

April 29th, 2020 we once again warned everyone about the importance of due process in this article and how we would see this issue come to courtrooms across the country.  We nailed it!

While we do take pride in knowing we provided the proper educational information on how the above matters should have been dealt with, I think the bigger message is you don’t have to be an attorney to understand the law and stand up for your rights when your local government oversteps their authority.

When some local official tells me I have to wear a mask, my pushback is not about whether a mask does or does not work.  It’s about the key question people must start demanding an answer to, which is what authority is given to you to tell me to do x,y,z.

What we have learned over the last 11 years of watchdogging is that a lot of local government attorneys are more along the lines of paper pushers and advocates for whatever the client wants to do.  For the few that have courtroom litigation experience, they have no problem giving questionable advice that results in more billable hours.  And for the record, there are some great local government attorneys that we have come across so no, not all attorneys are bad, just most of them.

An example of questionable advice can be found in Windsor School District last week.  Even after two courts in the very same circuit found the schools could not issue a mask mandate, the School Board suspended a teacher for not wearing a mask and the attorney was present the entire time.  We have been told their position was the cases did not apply to their school.  We agree cases against other schools do not make it case law statewide, but when you can clearly see the results being obtained, day after day, why would you not recognize your policy is subject to the same type of lawsuit and take steps to correct it rather than expose yourself to a lawsuit?

While we published the definition of quarantine clear back in April of 2020, we are excited to see the definition finally being applied as it is written.  Examples of that can be found in articles here, here, here and we suspect in many other courtrooms across the state in the coming months.

What happens when the people push back against government action?  The government takes steps to change the law or rules.  It would not surprise me to see the definition of quarantine changed because that is the Illinois way.  When the government is caught breaking the law, the pattern is to change it to make their bad actions legal with the stroke of a pen.  Break the law, change the law.

As we move forward, please remember we told you so!

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22 Comments
  • jannie
    Posted at 11:12h, 18 September

    This has become such a “political” issue, We know, ,masks prevent infection – otherwise why is your dental hygenist wearing one. This is a health emergency I suppose during a hurricane or after a tornado those who have rights – won’t give 2 cents about the life & health of the community. Oh, well – they can grandstand all they want. Right Now it’s pretty much each individual has to look out for themselves – because it’s become political not what’s best for the health & safety of people.

    • Kirk Allen
      Posted at 11:34h, 18 September

      I totally agree we need to look out for ourselves because the fact remains, it is not the government’s job.

      • Truth Teller
        Posted at 16:59h, 18 September

        It is the government’s job to protect its citizens. Are you seriously stating that if a food corporation or an automobile company produced poisoned foods or cars that burst into flames that the government has no role in regulation of those events after thousands or hundreds of people die? Hundreds of years of regulation and laws means you’re wrong.

        In Jacobson vs. Massachusetts the Supreme Court ruled in 1905; the Court upheld the authority of states to enforce compulsory vaccination laws. The Court’s decision articulated the view that individual liberty is not absolute. Massachusetts law empowered the board of health of individual cities and towns to enforce mandatory vaccinations. So your right to do anything you want has its limits. Public health emergencies are part of those limits.

        Masking saves lives, especially those who can’t be vaccinated which includes children. I’d be somewhat sympathetic with the anti masker cause, but the actions and behavior of people like you is totally abhorrent, A teenage boy in Tennessee is mock and heckled by anti mask adults during a School Board meeting. School board members are threatened and anti maskers show up at their homes with bull horns, some people are armed. In Villa Park,, the School Board meeting had to be stopped since anti maskers threatened the Board members, Anti maskers escorted out by police. I could go on.

        Mask have repeated been shown to stop the aerosol droplets from COV-19. It is one simple mitigation that stops the virus. It is also a simple public health mitigation that is TOTALLY in the power of a Executive of a state.

        • Kirk Allen
          Posted at 19:46h, 18 September

          Protect them from what? Please cite the Constitutional provision that supports your position. While our government has created all kinds of regulatory offices, those deal with goods and services. It is not the government’s place to mandate health devices or procedures. The courts are finally ruling on that matter.

          You take a position that predisposes you know what my position is on a matter. You’re wrong. I am not anti masker. I am simply one who demands the rule of law be followed and while you think the mask saves lives, you are unable to produce one study that proves it saved lives as it relates to this pandemic. There are no studies that its saving lives, only assumptions and speculations.

          To each their own when it comes to a mask but until you can provide me a single law that allows the government to enforce a mask mandate, your words mean nothing. If a person wants to wear one that is fine and those who attack them for doing it need called out. Just like those who attack those not wearing one need called out.

          While you continue to make claims without actual studies, the CDC all but buried the Georgia study on masks that disproved your claims on them. Might do you well to go read it.

          And for the record, Case law in Illinois reflects Executive powers are only applicable to State agencies. That case was cited last year in a case the Governor lost.

          Show me why Illinois has such high numbers even though we have had the most restrictive mandates around. Why are documents being held for a year and only being produced after they got sued? Why do the Delta numbers not come close to matching what the Governor is saying? You can blindly follow all his garbage and I hope it works out for you but I am done listening to a man who has lied over and over.

          • Truth Teller
            Posted at 12:14h, 19 September

            “Protect from what:”? So you think that seat belts should be oppositional, meat shouldn’t be inspected and medicines shouldn’t be under control by the FDA? So according to you dangerous and ineffective medicines should share the shelf with aspirin. You’re not an anti-masker? Really? You certainly not fooling me, you most certainly are one. There ARE plenty of studies proving the efficacy of masks, Studies disproving the efficacy of masks have been shown to be flawed and down right wrong. If mask wearing is pointless as you say, then ask your dentist to remove his mask and breathe his bacteria and what ever viruses from his mouth directly into your mouth.

            Also pray tell why would the CDC “bury” any study that disproved the use of masks. Sorry, that smacks of going down a rabbit hole of bat crap crazy conspiracy theories. If the CDC did not publish the study, then the study DID NOT stand up to peer review. Studies from Germany and other countries have been proven unable to stand up to peer review which is the gold standard of science. Sorry, stories you post from a newspaper in Wisconsin isn’t scientific proof of anything. That goes double for many of the claim made in far right news sources. Ivermectin isn’t a cure for COV-19 neither is hydroxychloroquine. Mask work just like seat belts work.

            I also cited the Supreme Court case in 1905 that states CAN enforce mandatory vaccinations, quarantines as necessary public health mitigations in emergencies with a pandemic. Your freedom can be curtailed in a public health emergency.

            Sorry I’m so done with “libertarians” like you stating you just want something legal. No you don’t, you want to clog the courts with your cause de jure, damn how many people get hurt or die. If you want to see a state that drowning in libertarian freedom, go to Idaho. The hospital are full of COV-19 patients on ventilators they’re putting up tents in the parking lots. Their COV-19 deaths are going through the roof. States in the Southeastern are also at their limits on hospitalizations. That’s what anti-masking and anti-science ideology get you, rationing care in hospitals. That’s what their reduced to doing in many overwhelmed hospitals. You’re too far gone, too bad. Evidently that’s what you want.

            For Pete’s sake, get vaccinated, wear masks when needed. Thank God that the Governor of Illinois actually listens to science not crack pots like you.

          • Kirk Allen
            Posted at 11:29h, 22 September

            Why must you spin everything said and then imply it was a position I took? They did publish the study. Go read it. And then note they had to qualify the results to imply masks offered “some” benefit.

            No one said any drug was a cure so why do you go down that rabbit hole. Are there drugs that help beat it when taken early, yes. Japan proved that, as have many other countries.

            You say you’re done with libertarians like me? When did I become a libertarian?

            If you’re done then we won’t need to respond anymore.

            Thank You!

        • PK
          Posted at 21:53h, 18 September

          If you’ve got an internet link to the research for “Mask have repeated been shown to stop the aerosol droplets from COV-19.” please post it here.

        • PK
          Posted at 18:15h, 20 September

          Within the news articles are links to reference studies, bone head…I mean “TRUTH TELLER.” Also, the a lot of detail in the 1905 case missing from your narrow view. Now please stop your boring narrative amd post a link to support your comment regarding “COV-19.”

    • Dee
      Posted at 13:03h, 18 September

      When you go to the dentist’s office watch closely to make sure they are sanitary. I had to ask my dentist to change his gloves twice. After the dentist or hygienist put their gloves on, be aware that they do not touch things like their mask, safety glasses, clothing or anything else that is not cleaned or changed between patients. My dentist had a mask that looked dirty and he had just been with another patient (drilling, etc) and things from that patient could splatter up onto his mask and safety glasses. He then touched his mask and safety glasses with the new gloves that he was going to use for my mouth. The good news about masks is that each person can decide for themselves if they would like to wear one. Masks do no stop the spread of viral or bacterial respiratory infections.

    • Frank Miller
      Posted at 18:12h, 19 September

      “… otherwise why is your dental hygenist wearing one.”

      Its a splash guard, nothing more. Don’t take my word for it, just ask any health professional if they were ever taught that a mask would prevent infection transmission prior to 2020.

  • Marvin Stichnoth
    Posted at 14:10h, 18 September

    Jannie, why is it that Illinois citizens must mask up but right across the state line in Indiana they do not? Are we in Illinois more susceptible to the virus than those in Indiana? Seems to me that they are doing as well or better than we in Illinois are in handling the virus. So it must be a political and power thing rather than science. If masking helped much we in Illinois would have a much lower rate of Covid than in Indiana. (And by the way, 50 years ago my dentist wore neither a mask nor gloves and I nor anyone I know contracted any disease from a visit to his office.)

  • Golden Country
    Posted at 08:20h, 19 September

    KUDOS to ECW for being consistent about the application of existing laws during the outbreak of this virus and shame on the Judicial branch for sitting on sidelines for so long.
    As evidence by the above few posters the government has installed fear and division amongst citizens on how we respond to this specific virus. It comes down what degree of protection is needed. True there are many government regulations that are in place to protect individuals against other everyday activities but none come close to the degree that is being pushed with vaccinations and mask mandates. If the same level of control was being used to drive a vehicle (i.e Zero Deaths) than highways would be 100 foot wide, passenger vehicles would weigh 10 tons and the speed limit would be no higher than 10 mph.. Applying these measure changes life as we know it, and economies and society would collapse. One has to look no further than last year to see the continuing negative effects of the lock downs and make no mistake its not the virus that caused this but Illinois government response to it.
    This is about the benefit to cost that is applied to the risks that we face every day and the unrealistic demands being placed on Illinois citizens by Pritzker. So yes it has become Political and you can blame those that push vaccinations and mask mandates for causing the fear mongering and divisiveness in Illinois.

  • PK
    Posted at 10:56h, 19 September

    To the ECWd’s experience with Illinois law and those who profess to practice that law, I’ve been wondering about why Illinois courts seem to take more time than courts in other states. The state’s answer to the 30 IEMAA question is but a.n example.

    For the most part, lawyers and lawfirms operate on billable hours. Obviously, the slower they go, the more they earn. Further, while being knowledgeable and deliberate is a lawful good,. being expeditious with those same characteristics, especially in times of crisis, would be a helluva lot better. So why are Illinois courts so slow in comparison to other states? I’ll guess that on a per capita basis, there are more register attorneys practicing in Illinois’ judiciary than in other states. Also, the ARDC acts as gatekeeper. In my own experience, their bar often seems set and kept low.

    • Kirk Allen
      Posted at 11:21h, 19 September

      My experience is that ARDC never holds firms accountable but have no problem going after private practitioners. Our courts are slow because of the Judges. They constantly push things out 30 days and never hold attorneys accountable to a timeline set. This is ONE of the reasons why I support voting NO on all judge retentions. They have it to easy and need to be held accountable and be subject to the same political voting process as every other elected position.

      • PK
        Posted at 11:56h, 19 September

        To be sure, judges are peer associates to attorneys coming before them. Again, we’re talking about ‘professional’ industry operating in Illinois’ judiciary. So, on a per capita basis, how does Illinois compare with other states with respect registered and practicing lawyers….including judges?

        Get this though: According to a senior council member of the Attorney Registration and Discipline Commission (ARDC), the ARDC does not investigate alleged violations of Local Rules of Practice! So when it comes to state courts, I’m aghast to realize the ARDC provides ZERO quality assurance to the circuit(s) presiding judge(s), the district(s) chief(s), and/or litigants in their courts.

      • kathiann
        Posted at 18:31h, 19 September

        Speaking of ARDC, I am still awaiting their decision to discipline a certain attorney who lied about Illinois statute and deceived a board of citizen members at the county Housing Authority.. I wonder if they will.

  • Jim
    Posted at 13:32h, 19 September

    There are three branches of government. The Legislative Branch. The Executive Branch and The Judicial Branch. At least that is what was taught to us in public schools years ago. What the Truth Teller is referring to is what we call an Oligarchy or better know as the administrative branch of government. As for those people they can take a flying leap off a tall building. They have not and do not represent or care about the majority of Americans. I don’t need them nor do I want them steeping on my constitutional rights. Somebody needs to brush up on their knowledge of our constitution.

  • Laura Robinson
    Posted at 16:06h, 19 September

    Masks and shots do not prevent, nor do they cure Covid. They are tools we have to simply TRY to suppress the spread and keep the curve steady. We can’t agree about that, it’s gotten too political, etc.. So. Now we have a country (OUR country people!) that has been divided and conquered. It’s awful that this is the rock that we have chosen to die on. I honestly believe that we are NEVER going to get back to normal. Never. Our way of life is going extinct. It makes me wonder if this is nature, trying to preserve itself. In the meantime, I have what will most likely be our last family reunion, and I am completely completely confused. We have maskers, non maskers, elderly people who this gathering is for, vaxers, anti-vaxers…… what do I do? There’s only 9 of us are left in our family. Please excuse the misspelled words and poor sentence structure in this post.

    • Tony
      Posted at 23:35h, 20 September

      In my opinion, nationally, the only way back to normal MIGHT be a constitutional convention. And only maybe because if not enough is done to curb gov over reach and special interest shenanigans, then it wouldn’t matter anyway.

      This is why strong local government is quintessential to future normalcy. The more that can be done closer to home, the more normal life can be returned to for much of the day-to-day, and it gives those stronger communities some insulation against big gov. Stupidity.

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